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The Book of Revelation: An Interview with Bill and Cher Holton – Straight Talk Radio

By October 12, 2015 No Comments

There are times that either the topic that you might get into when it’s a religious conversation either will be incredibly boring or incredibly controversial. Now we’ve got more incredibly controversial because we’re going to talk about the Book of Revelation.

I want you to think that we’re not going to have a show that will put you to sleep by any stretch of the imagination. In fact, we’ll stretch your imaginations by talking with our guests, Bill and Cher Holton, both ministers and Bill has just written a new book. Book of RevelationThe name of the book The Book of Revelation, New Metaphysical Version. I think what you’re going to find in this show is that we’re going to take some really difficult concepts to talk about and break them down into a way that actually will make sense and can apply in your life.

I’m 57 years old and I’ve been in church for a number of years and the one thing that has always been the profound problem is trying to talk about what does the Book of Revelation mean?

So, Bill and Cher, I am thrilled to have you back again as a guest here on Straight Talk Radio and we’re going to have a straight talk about the Book of Revelation, but I have to ask you on the front side, okay, I know you’ve been in a corporate consulting business since 1984 and you created the Global Centre for Spiritual Practices. Give us a little bit of a snapshot of where you are right now and what motivated you to take on such an interesting topic.


CHUCK: Hi, this is Chuck Gallagher with Straight Talk Radio and there are times you sit back and you think about, if you’re doing a radio show, what kind of show do you want to do and what would really create some unique and interesting controversy? And I think, well, I think we’ve got a pretty good chance today that that will be the case.

So, I remember as a kid, two things. Well, I remember more than two things, let me just say that, although, at my age remembering two things probably is in it of itself is okay, but I remember one time sitting in church many, many, many years ago, Southern Baptist Church, and I’ll never forget. It was one of those Sunday night Bible studies and okay, I’m going to out myself, but I’m sitting there like on the second or third row and the minister that night was bo-ring. I’m so sad to say that, but I had to sing that night, so here I was having so much fun singing, but then I sat down for the message that evening and I started to drift off.

I don’t know if you can, especially on radio, kind of catch this picture, but here I am and all of a sudden, my eyes start walling back in head and my head starts nodding uncontrollably, like it does on the airplane when it’s a red-eye flight. I’m sitting there, just nodding my head and finally, I’m kind of in this space of being partially there and partially not and I heard the minister say so clearly, “Well, at least there’s one person that agrees with me here tonight,” and I knew he was talking about me.

[Bill laughs]

BILL: Well, thank you. One of the things we do in our profession and ministry is we certainly hope that we help people transform where they are to what they can be so we have a similar goal in our business that you do on your Transformation Talk Radio. One of the things that prompted me to write this book as a minister is that it seems The Book of Revelation would be a culmination of your teachings, if you will.

CHUCK: Sure.

BILL: It’s the last book in the Bible and we wanted to give people a perspective that was different from what most of us grew up with from the theology that we were taught as children. I always felt that there was more to the Book of Revelation than what I was hearing, what I was studying in Bible class and then, of course, when Cher and I became Unity ministers and moved into Unity Theology, I knew that there was very different way to tell that story differently than what folks heard before. That would be from a metaphysical view. What’s Cher to tell you what we mean by a metaphysical view versus other lenses that people may tend to look at Revelation, we’ll look at life.

CHER: Yeah, one of the ways that we approach it is to look at what we call the “field of infinite potential”, which is, some people use the word God, some people use divine energy, but it’s this infinite field out there that is limitless and within that field are all these little pockets of awareness. So we have a Baptist pocket of awareness, which is that perception and the lens through which they see things. We might have the Catholic version, we might have the atheist version. They’re all different levels of awareness within this perspective and our level of awareness is a metaphysical one, which means we look at things as if they’re happening within us so everything in the Book of Revelation, for example, all those weird symbols that scare people to death, we reinterpret as these are things happening within us as we evolve in consciousness to become enlightened, if you will.

CHUCK: When you think about what you just said, it’s kind of like, and I see the vision of this and I’ve seen it in movies where there’s the drop of water that you can see the whole ocean in and it kind of is a visual symbol for the drop represents all of water. It’s not changed. It’s a function of where the drop happens to be at a given point in time, but not the potential of what that drop is.

CHER: Right, and within that drop is the potential of the entire ocean.

CHUCK: Right.

CHER: It’s sort of like, I like a wave even better than a drop, but the wave can’t be a wave without the ocean, but the ocean can be the ocean without the wave. You can go get your bucket at the beach and capture a wave, but when you get it at home, it’s not a wave anymore.

CHUCK: Right.

CHER: It needs the beach to be a wave, it needs the ocean so we are the expression of that field of infinite potential.

BILL: And what’s interesting, Chuck, is that this book is also written with a scientific basis too so that is not just a figment of Bill Holton’s imagination as to what Revelation is saying, but a lot of what interpretation’s based on is sound science from quantum physics, from the neurosciences, from epigenetics, from biology. All that is also incorporated in the interpretation of this last book.

CHUCK: Bill, let me go backwards for just a second. You know, when I say, “You know,” you would know, you probably do, but for most of us in the United States, for most of us, for most of the listeners and most of us in the United States, we have been reared in what most would refer to it as a Christian nation. Not that we are not a homogeneous group of people, but fundamentally it has been a Christian nation. I guess the question begs, when you go back a long time ago to the actual physical formation of the Bible, Revelation has been the last chapter. Was it always the last chapter? And is there a difference between what a Methodist might see Revelation as versus a Baptist versus a Catholic?

BILL: Yeah. Well, it’s interesting that you say that because, yeah, it was adopted, if you will, as the last book to follow the canon, to follow Paul’s writings, as sort of a last measure into new to be a warning to us all that we’ve given you the teachings of Jesus. We’ve given you Paul’s explanation and several other writers in the New Testament and now this is a warning for you to pay attention! It’s almost like pointing a finger at you to say, “You better pay attention or this is what’s going to happen,” and it was written as an end of days.

As a matter of fact, our different interpretations of Revelation, some people believe, I should say one viewpoint is [11:07] be a point, which holds that Revelation outlines [11:12] what’s occurred in the first century, especially as it relates to the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D. Another one is a more historical perspective that ascertains that Revelation identifies prominent world leaders as benevolent or the bad guys, if you will, as supposed to be dealt with in the coming days.

Another view that’s called the futurist view positions Revelation as an end of days [11:45] Book of Prophecy that occurs at the end of the world as we know it.

CHER: This is the one that makes for great movies.

CHUCK: Right.

[Cher laughs]

BILL: Yeah.

CHER: Apocalypse Now.

BILL: Yeah, like a Mad Max kind of movie kind of thing going on. My view is more a metaphysical view, a more spiritual view, which the takes the gloom and doom completely out of revelation so it differs radically, of course, from what you just said and what we’ve all grown up with and it explains in more allegorical, metaphorical terms and it implies that the places and people and events, the symbolism mentioned in Revelation while all traits and qualities and characteristics within each of us, an external focus, futuristic focus and really brings it into the present and now moment as qualities within us.

CHUCK: I can’t wait for us to continue. We’re pushing up on a break. The book is The Book of Revelation, New Metaphysical Version. Bill is the author. Bill and Cher are with me here today. They head up the Global Centre for Spiritual Practices. I am thrilled to have you as my guests. Stick with us. When we get right back, we’re going to talk about some of those weird, odd things that are in Revelation and how we can actually make that better for us today. Stick with us on Straight Talk Radio.

[Commercial break]

CHUCK: Bill and Cher Holton are my guests here on Straight Talk Radio. The Book of Revelation, New Metaphysical Version is what we’re talking about and we’ve started off talking about what the book has been to a lot of people.

Bill, you made the comment that it was capping off the Bible at the end, kind of saying, “Okay, we told you everything to know. Now you better watch out or bad stuff can happen to you.” I know that I have said in many of a meeting, some in the Bible settings, where, boy, you were preached at and preached to with Revelation and still the fear of God in you to act in a way that God would want you to act as perceived by the filters of those that are involved in that.

So, take us on a journey. Now, supposedly, the Book of Revelation was written by John the Apostle. I assume that there’s some controversy, but what’s your take on that?

BILL: Yeah, there is and continues to be, the author identifies himself as John from Patmos and what’s interesting is that some scholars say that the author was in fact a Jewish Christian, most likely from Ephesus know, as John the Elder who lived during the reign of Emperor Domitian in 81 to 96-ish C.E. It has precise identity, but it does remain unknown, however, and modern scholarship commonly refers to him as John of Patmos, as I mentioned.

Revelation was probably written around 94-ish C.E. and some people, there are some scholars who even believe that it wasn’t a person named John at all. I’ll leave that to the Biblical scholars, would not call myself a Biblical scholar. I would certainly call myself a fan of Bible knowledge wrapped up to its metaphysical level, which is the perspective, the lens I deal with when I read sacred literature, but I would place, after my three years of research writing this book, I would really place Revelation to follow the four gospels to follow John, which is where I think it should be because it’s just not about end times at all. It’s about the fulfillment what happens to us when we take the teachings of, and you’ll hear me say, and it’s you probably, Christ as Jesus to heart and apply them. When you do that and become more towards your enlightenment, if you will, that’s what I believe that book of Revelation is. It’s a manual describing the process of our, in fact, becoming enlightened.

CHUCK: Let’s take, Bill and Cher, let’s take some of the symbols and concepts in the Bible, and I want to say in Revelation in the Bible, but in Revelation in specific, some of these have either been ramped up to be very scary or when you read it, it just isn’t a nice little read. It’s more a Stephen King kind of gig. I mean, you kind of have to back off a little bit thinking, man, whatever this is talking about, doesn’t look pretty, so let’s talk about the beast.

BILL: Okay.

CHER: Okay. So the beast is nothing more than our own ego and from a metaphysical perspective, and it’s the part of us that doesn’t recognize the value, the truth of who we are. It’s a part of us that denies that divinity within us. It’s a part of us that’s going after the material and focusing on that and kind of egging us on to want more and more and more. When you read about the beast in Revelation, that’s how you can interpret it. That’s a part of us that is kind of challenging us. It’s the inner voice that pushes us to make some choices that aren’t always wise.

CHUCK: That’s really a fascinating comment. How do you reconcile the ego which each of us have as incarnate human beings, how do you reconcile the ego with really finding out the truth about our soul and who we are? How do those two things work together or do they?

[Bill chuckles]

CHER: That’s a great question, because some people believe the ego is bad. We don’t take that perspective. It’s just that ego that is not controlled. Like if the ego takes control of our thoughts, then that’s not a good thing, but if we can use the ego in a positive way, what we want to do is merge our human self with our divine Self, so that’s enlightening, that when we truly bring those together.

If I could take one more symbol from Revelation, the bottomless pit, which you often hear about in relationship with the beast, that bottomless pit is metaphysically where we are, when we’re in that place where we want more and more and more. So you know when people keep going, “I’m going after this and I got this and got this job and I bought this car,” there must be more to life than this. I mean, you hear people saying that, “There must be something more there in that bottomless pit experience.” And if the beast is taking over, pushing to want more from a material side, as opposed to looking at that spiritual depth within.

BILL: The ego is that part of us, of our human personality that is addicted to materialism, to worldliness as opposed to spirituality and religion. Whenever you have a spiritual thought, you’re really moving out of the ego because you’re subordinating the ego, which is a very earthy, wordly part of us, to a higher part of us, which is our spiritual Self.

CHUCK: It’s interesting as you say that. I can connect with that without any question because what that did is it transformed me back to 1987, almost 30 years ago at this point, but it transformed me back to the young or mid to late twenties when it was all about the car, the house, the clothes, the shoes, the watch. Anything external helped make you somebody.

CHER: Right.

CHUCK: So the ego sought for the external trappings and it did create a bottomless pit because the reality was you kept digging and clamoring for the, what I call, stuff. Kids today might call it “bling”, whatever, but at least for me, I kept clamoring for the stuff until such point in time as the proverbial house of cards was pulled and it was like, okay, you have made such poor choices trying to feed your ego that you have lost your identity with your soul and to me that was, what I would refer to as, a dark night of the soul.

I think people can have them in different ways, but it’s interesting to think about the ego is a beast. I want to throw this question out to you. It’s a little weird, but dealing with those two things, the beast and the bottomless pit, I also look, and this is a judgment, therefore it may not be right at all, but I look at Bill Gates and I say to myself, “Well, here’s a person that saw a concept and changed the world with the concept in terms of Microsoft, which is very earthly and very tangible, so to speak, but yet the incredible wealth that he’s created has allowed him to transcend beyond just being a business guy to literally trying to brining into malaria and do a whole host of things with the wealth that he’s received that the average person is not ever going to have the chance to do.”

CHER: That’s a great example. It doesn’t say you can’t have wealth. It doesn’t say, “Don’t have material things,” but who controls what?

CHUCK: Right.

CHER: Your material things control you, which is where you’re constantly going after more and more and more to bring me that peace or from a place of peace do I create from this field of infinite potential, which allows me then to use it for good.

CHUCK: Right.

CHER: And I think you nailed it and we all have the ability. It may not be at the level that we see Bill Gates doing it, but everybody has the ability to claim from that field of infinite potential with divine ideas that allow them to express.

BILL: What’s very interesting is Bill Gates and Warren Buffet and others actually epitomize what Cher and I would say that you are a wealthy and direct proportion to that to what you can do without. They could amass immense material fortunes and possessions, if you will, but they opt out of that to help people.

CHUCK: Yeah, it’s fascinating. We go back to the very first segment where we were talking about the ocean is the wave and you can capture it in a bucket, and the reality of all of that is each of us have the potential. Now, my potential may be reflected as a drop of water, but yet that drop of water to a small plant is just as significant as a gully washer might mean to California at this point and God knows they need that. So, yeah, it’s fascinating to look at it from a different perspective, the Book of Revelation.

We have just a moment before we have to go to the break and I literally mean maybe just a minute. Let’s start with the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse.

[Cher chuckles]

CHUCK: If that’s even possible or maybe we need to hold that for the next segment as we’ve only got a minute. I will say this, we’ll hold it because I know there’s just a minute, but I remember the movie Pale Rider with Clint Eastwood.

[Cher chuckles]

CHUCK: You know, it was like the Four Horsemen in and it was a great movie and yet at the same time it was so symbolic of what people could get or what they were talking about or would have heard about.

My guest today is Bill and Cher Holton and we’re talking about the Book of Revelation. I really do thing that what you’ve been able to do with your book is something that’s going to make a difference for everyone, so stick with us for just a second. We’re on Straight Talk Radio. We’re going to come back and talk about the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse and the Seven-Headed Dragon if I can spit it out. Stick with me. We’ll be right back.

[Commercial break]

CHUCK: This is Chuck Gallagher with Straight Talk Radio and we are talking about The Book of Revelation, New Metaphysical Version. Yes, the Book of Revelation from the Bible, and my guests are Bill and Cher Holton. Bill is the author of this book and we’ve been talking about some of the symbols in revelation and the scary things and right before the break, I was going to break in with this, but I thought, we’ll just hold it to right now. Let’s talk about the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse.

BILL: Folks, we’ll start with that. We’ll pre-empt the rest of Chuck’s show because we’re going to in the territory that a lot of folks have not heard the territory explained this way before, so we’re going to ask you religious folks to keep an open mind and by all means fasten your seatbelts.

[Cher laughs]

CHUCK and BILL: Here we go!

BILL: Metaphysically, the White Horse stands for our ability to defriend dogma.

[Cher laughs]

BILL: Climb out of the dogmatic box that we’d probably been in for years, keep dogma in its place, beware of [26:49] lies convention and tradition, be willing to let go and release those concepts to move towards your spiritual, not necessarily religious, but spiritual good. That’s what the White Horse stands for.

CHUCK: Bill, let me ask you a quick question on dogma. You said it’s the White Horse’s to release it. Why was it there to begin with? What did it serve?

BILL: The purpose, yeah…

[Cher laughs]

BILL: Wow, that’s a whole show in itself.

[Chuck laughs]

BILL: Good question because a lot of folks love the dogmatic and we’re going to call it blinder. You put blinders on your consciousness, if you will, if you want to live in dogma. So it’s okay if you want to live in dogma. It’s a place Cher and I have been. It’s not a place that we continue to live in. As a matter of fact, we stay out of the dogmatic box and look at it from a distance now. It developed because the religious powers that be, if you will, in any denomination, arrived at certain doctrinal beliefs which are dogmatic and are supposed to be the end-all and be-all a knowledge concerning that particular concept.

The believers, the followers then are expected to conform to those beliefs and not question those beliefs, and Cher and I say that one of the chief things we believe that interferes with your spiritual growth is not so much the not answered questions, but the unquestioned answers, and dogma is one of those unquestioned answers that you need to grow out of.

CHER: It’s really designed for control more than anything. It’s a good way to keep people in control.

CHUCK: I want to get to the other Horses. I promise I do, but one of the things that really strikes me is if you go back a long, long time ago, hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of years, the dogma was the Earth was flat.

CHER: Right.

CHUCK: And if you challenged it, you’d be put to death until we found out it was wrong.

[Cher laughs]

CHUCK: And now we look back and say, “Well, that was the dumbest thing that I’ve ever heard in a long time,” but at the time, that was the belief and failure to follow the belief was wrong.

CHER: Right.

CHUCK: So the question today would be, how many things do we take as Law and Gospel? That’s the way it is, only to find out a thousand years from now people would look back at us and say, “What dummies! Can you believe that?!”

BILL: That’s one of the things we think that mainstream religion, fundamental religion has against science. Science should be a symbiotic relationship with religion, but science may tend to pull people out of the dogma they believe in with due findings in science.

CHUCK: Right.

BILL: We think that that’s why there’s such a disconnect between science and religion.

CHUCK: Now, knowing we got a short amount of time, let’s talk about the other Horses.

CHER: Okay, let’s do the Red Horse. The Red Horse really represents zeal and enthusiasm, but it’s our ability to keep it in check so that we get excited and have this excitement about everything new that we’re learning and as we’re growing and becoming enlightened, but we don’t let it run away with us. So the Red Horse is kind of controlled enthusiasm.

CHUCK: Okay.

CHER: Again, remember, coupled whip, because we have to take all these four horses together. If you don’t have all four there, it won’t take you where you’re going, so we got keeping dogma in its place and not letting it define us, and then we have the zeal and enthusiasm for what we’re learning.

CHUCK: Okay.

BILL: The Black Horse metaphysically stands for making sound judgments or having proper discernment in your decision making. It’s a very decisive kind of ability that we have and again, we’re just giving you a small snapshot of what these stand for, obviously.

CHUCK: Right.

CHER: But if you could see that now you’ve got your questioning dogma and you got excitement, but it’s tempered with wisdom, because zeal without wisdom can just run you amok. [laughs]

CHUCK: Yeah, right. Absolutely.

CHER: [31:14] wisdom without zeal and you can be stuck.

CHUCK: Right.

CHER: We’re putting all these together and then the fourth horse is the Pale Horse that you referred to with Clint Eastwood, and it represents the end of sense consciousness. So this is essentially letting go of our addictions, of our bad habits, of any negative thoughts and attitudes that we have, hanging on to grudges. It’s letting go, it’s releasing all of those things. That’s what the Pale Horse represents.

CHUCK: So, tie for me together, if you will the– Okay. I get the four horses, but the Apocalypse word tends to have that emotional charge that it’s the explosion, it’s the end, it’s time gone as we know it.

BILL: That’s the perfect place to go with this and yeah, if there’s any apocalypse and there will be, it’s not an external world stage global catastrophe. The apocalypse metaphysically is simply referring to your current level of egocentric consciousness which becomes subordinate to your higher level of Christ consciousness. It’s when your ego, your human self becomes subordinated to your higher, spiritual Self. The Apocalypse is where the ego’s control, the ego’s rulership over your life ends.

CHER: And your higher Self wins out.

BILL: Yeah, that’s the Apocalypse when the ego loses its rulership and then your spiritual nature rules your thoughts and your decisions, etc. Armageddon is the same thing. Armageddon takes place between your ears. It doesn’t take place between countries. It takes place between your ears because it’s about your consciousness changing from one level of perspective to higher, more Christed level of perspective.

CHUCK: Now, in the time that we have in this segment, the next, I guess, symbol would be the Seven-Headed Dragon. So we’ve gone from horses to dragons. I’m seeing Game of Thrones right now.

[Cher chuckles]

CHUCK: These dragons flying around us. Okay, talk to us about that.

CHER: And what’s it all about Revelation really? These images. It’s a very image-dramatic book.

CHUCK: Oh, no kidding.

CHER: Yeah, all the symbols, and you think about when kids are learning to read, they have a few words and lots of pictures to help them, and that’s really what Revelation is all about because it’s a concept of enlightenment which is way beyond what most of us are so we need a lot of vivid imagery to help us. That’s why these are so powerful and so vivid in their description. So here’s the Seven-Headed Beast Dragon.

BILL: Yeah, the Seven-Headed Beast or Dragon, yeah.

CHER: With 10 horns, by the way.

BILL: Yeah.

[Cher laughs]

CHUCK: Okay.

CHER: That’s important. [chuckles]

BILL: I remind your listeners again that what we’re talking about are traits, qualities, characteristics, talents, abilities, inclinations within any each of us.

CHUCK: Okay.

BILL: That’s what the Seven-Headed Beast is referring to. So, the seven heads represent the seven deadly sins: envy, gluttony, greed, lust, pride, sloth, wrath, etc. The ten horns on the beast represent the ten expressions of unconditional love. For those who may be interested, that’s according to Saint John of the Cross. They can look up those ten major expressions. As a matter of fact, it’s in a Saint John’s 16th century book called The Dark Night of the Soul is where they can find them. I have them listed in the book, of course, in the endnotes. The seven crowns, I’m going to ask your listeners, once again, they might want to double fasten thier seatbelt on this one because–

CHUCK: Okay, we’ve got about a minute before break, so just let me give you that, okay.

BILL: Thank you. The seven crowns represent the seven Churches that Revelation talks about, but the seven Churches represent our seven spiritual energy centers that run along our spine and they come from our etheric or vital body and they stand toward the seven major chakras and I borrowed that from the Hindu philosophy system. They are actually putting two chakras on all, but these are the seven main chakras that run along our spinal column, which happens to be the narrow way, if you will, toward spiritual enlightenment.

CHUCK: Now, this is really fascinating. Before we go to break, we’ve got about one minute, I want to ask a really simple question that might need a complex answer, but everything that you explained starts to really make much more intelligent and logical sense to connect with, and I’m very thankful for that, but we started, one of the comments was to let go of dogma, right? The White Horse. So, if that’s the case, it sure seems that the way the book was written not only didn’t get us away from dogma, it actually tied us into it.

BILL: Yes, by design.

CHUCK: Okay.

BILL: That was definitely by design because fundamental religion, basically any religion, not just Christianity, is meant for control and for conformity. The more a sacred writing can attest to that conformity and get the believers taking in a certain way so that they can perpetuate that particular religion, that particular pocket, as you mentioned earlier, that’s what’s in it for, that particular religion.

CHUCK: Wow. Okay, I’m going to have to cogitate on that during the break. We’re going to come back. We’re going to talk about a variety of things. The book is The Book of Revelation, New Metaphysical Version. My guests are Reverend Bill and Cher Holton and I am thrilled to have you guys here. This is absolutely a blast to be able to talk about and to bring a different perspective to light. So, stick with us on Straight Talk Radio. This is Chuck Gallagher. We’ll be right back.

[Commercial break]

CHUCK: The Book of Revelation: New Metaphysical Version is what we’re talking about here on Straight Talk Radio. This is Chuck Gallagher and my guests are Bill and Cher Holton. Bill is the author of this new book and we have been talking about the Book of Revelation in a way that I have never heard it explained and in a way that makes so much sense.

We’ve talked about all kinds of symbols, but if there is one symbol that probably most folks, at least in the United States, are aware of it’s the mark of the Beast. It’s the 666 stamped on your forehead, bringing you in to making sure that everybody is numbered and we’re all part of this uniformity somehow and at least for those that teach the book in a dogmatic way, you don’t want the number! So talk to me about that so I can understand it.

CHER: Yeah, this is really cool because that has been such a frightful thing that people are afraid when they draw a number and it’s got 666 in it.

CHUCK: Oh, yeah.

CHER: Phone companies have trouble getting rid of phone numbers that have 666 in them and yet, really what it means from a metaphysical perspective is it represents us forgetting the truth of who we really are. It’s actually the number of man and we have scientific, and throughout the book, I want to make a point on this book that Bill has actually, half the book is endnotes. It’s very thoroughly researched and he’s done a lot of scientific support for it as well. There is scientific support behind this number 666, which I’m going to allow him explain because he’s the one who’s into the science, but it’s really cool. Remember what it stands for, the symbol of man forgetting the truth of who we are.

BILL: Yeah, number 666 is the number of the beast within us, which is our ego, of course. Our unenlightened, [40:12] and denied ego. It was first noted in Old Manuscript form called the Textus Receptus written in about 55 to 68-ish A.D. and it was an encoded reference believed to be about [40:36], but it means more than that. In the kabalistic Judaism 666 is a number which represents the creation and perfection of the world. What’s interesting about that is the world that 666 is talking to is not the external world, not the universe, not planet Earth, but the world of our body, and what’s interesting about that is that carbon 12 is the basis of all known life. We are carbon beings and carbon 12 consists of 6 protons, 6 neutrons and 6 electrons – 666. So it’s describing our physical body.

CHUCK: Whoa!

BILL: That’s why it’s the number of man! Because it’s our physical body, and by the way, for those who may be interested, there was a scroll, a fragment found. It’s called Papyrus 115 discovered at Oxford University that gives the number of the beast as 616, not 666, and this fragment is the oldest manuscript from 17,000 years ago of Revelation 13, which is where the 666 appears. It just lets some scholars to conclude that 616 is the original number of the beast, which is interesting.

The other scientific reference that we promised has to do with Chapter 7 in Revelation, verse 9. I’ll read it very quickly. I’ll read the metaphysical, but if we don’t have time to do that… Okay.

CHUCK: It sure is cracking away, Bill.

BILL: Yeah.

CHUCK: It’s cracking away, buddy. [laughs]

BILL: Yeah, it has to.

[Cher and Chuck laugh]

BILL: But anyway it’s talking about ourselves. It mentions about the 12 tribes of Israel. It mentions about the great multitude, the nations, dendrites, that kind of thing. We have interpreted that as meaning ourselves and our bodies. Our body has over 90 billion cells in our brain and there are 100 trillion cells in our body, so we believe they multitude, that the nations that Revelation’s talking about, because again, everything is internal to us, it’s talking about ourselves and not about nations out there anywhere, if you will, and there’s evidence to support that.

CHER: A lot of the neuroscience research now is really talking about how important those cells are and how we can retrain our brain with our thinking, and that’s what enlightenment is all about. It’s creating whole new brain paths.

BILL: The Book, very quickly, it identifies the seven major spiritual centers, represented by the seven Churches. It also talks about what their function is. Then it also talks about what happens when they blossom or when they are opened by us through disciplined spiritual study, through prayer, through meditation, through affirmations, through visualizing our good, through spiritual practices, and when we get to that level of spiritual attainment, if you will, our body becomes very spiritualized.

Eventually, we believe every human being at some point, depending upon your spiritual development, will have the same type of body that as Christ Jesus had in his [44:17] where we can essentially walk through doors, walk through walls. You think that was a hint of what would happen to us. That’s included in that. It all comes together, we hope, as a manual, if you will, of our own individual spiritual development.

CHUCK: Bill, you took a number of years to write the book and I don’t think anybody that’s listening to this show would argue that you’ve taken a complex writing and it really worked to make it more understandable in a way that is applicable with the metaphysical version, but what was your goal in doing this in the first place?

BILL: I have to say that my goal is to get people to see the necessity of defriending dogma, moving out of the dogmatic box, opening their hearts and minds to a more broadband view of their spirituality and growing spiritually using the practices I talk about so that we can become more Self-realized and by “self” I mean capital “S” Self-realized. We have our small “s” self, our human self and a capital “S” Self, our divine Self, our spiritual Self. For human kind to be able to move toward the capital “S” Self realization and if we do that, we will achieve the peace on Earth that we all talk about. If we do that, you won’t hear the news like we all hear every day about what’s going on negatively so that’s what I hope to gain by this; to help people to realize who they really are, a spiritual being walking Earth in human form.

CHUCK: How do people get your book?

CHER: Oh, they can get the book through our website, which is They can get it there or they can go on Amazon. It’s also there.

CHUCK: Okay. So, The Book of Revelation, New Metaphysical Version at

CHER: Yourspiritualpractice.

CHUCK: Spiritual practice, sorry, or you can go to, the place where it seems all books are purchased these days.

[Cher laughs]

CHUCK: And get your copy of The Book of Revelation. Bill, Cher, this has been so enlightening. I want to applaud you before we end the program. It is true; today you hear all kinds of things on the news. Of course, today you hear things that 100 years ago we never would have heard because we didn’t have the ability to have mass communication the way we do today. That might lead some to believe that things are worse than they’ve ever been, but I can’t help but believe that when someone like you take the time to explain and allow us to evolve into the people who we truly are and move past the illusion that our ego creates, we can’t help but move into a better world.

BILL: Thank you. I agree.

CHER: And we want to say to people never confuse yourself with your net worth.

CHUCK: Oh, I like that!

CHER: And as you’re growing in your spiritual enlightenment, you’ll realize the power of that.

CHUCK: Right. The book is The Book of Revelation, New Metaphysical Version. I would encourage you to pick up a copy of the book, read it, delve into it and understand better what we’ve spent the time talking about.

My guests have been Bill and Cher Holton. Thank you so much for your time. This is Chuck Gallagher with Straight Talk Radio and as I say in every segment that we have, every choice has a consequence. Certainly, the consequences of reading this book will create a different place for you to look and to understand who you really are and the spiritual being that you have been blessed to be.

Bill, Cher, thank you so much for being with us. This is Chuck Gallagher and we’ll see you next time.

You’ve been listening to Straight Talk with Chuck Gallagher. Tune in each week on, each Monday at 2 p.m. Pacific, 5 p.m. Eastern as Chuck Gallagher, international speaker and author, cuts through the noise to share truth through transparency!

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